Wisconsin dairyman Chris Conley was motivated to make mammoth changes on his farm after attending a Dodge County Farmers for Healthy Soil and Water meeting in 2018. Almost five years later he’s gone from full tillage to 100% no-till and planting green across his 120 acres in Neosho, Wis.
On this episode of Cover Crop Strategies, brought to you by Verdesian Life Sciences, Conley explains why he made the switch and how he’s making it work with older equipment.
Conley also details his methods for planting green into cereal rye, grazing cover crops, plans for 2023 and more!
The Cover Crop Strategies podcast series is brought to you by Verdesian Life Sciences.
At Verdesian Life Sciences, we believe that supplying healthy water and soil for the next generation is just as important as supplying efficient nutrients for every crop farmers grow. For us, sustainability and profitability go hand in hand. That’s why we call ourselves The Nutrient Use Efficiency People. We have dedicated ourselves to providing prescriptive nutrient use efficiency solutions that improve plant uptake and reduce fertilizer losses, helping preserve the environment and make the most of your investment. Learn more at vlsci.com or talk to your ag retailer today about Verdesian products.
Full Transcript
Noah Newman:
Great to have you with us as always on another edition of the Cover Crop Strategies Podcast, brought to you by Verdesian Life Sciences. I'm your host, Noah Newman. This week, we're catching up with Chris Conley, a Wisconsin no tiller, who's made the switch from conventional tillage to 100% no-till and cover crops in just five years. Let's jump right in. Without further ado, here's Chris.
Chris Conley:
Hi, my name is Chris Conley. I farm in [inaudible 00:00:33], Wisconsin. That's located in Dodge County. Our farm is 174 acres. It consists of 120 acres of workable land. I've got 23 acres of permanent pasture. We milk 52 cows. It's myself, my wife, and my two daughters. And my grandma's also involved on the farm. We grow cover crops when the corn silage is off, and I take high moisture corn off. I plant green in the spring of the year, and I started two years ago now grazing my rye cover crop off with my cattle, and now I'm transitioning into doing even more grazing where I am working on cutting first and second cutting, and then starting to transition into grazing a third and fourth crop. And then, when the fall of year when I get my corn silage off and my high moisture corn, I let the cows graze over to corn and hayfields. I got a pasture on the boundary of the farm, so I just let the cows go [inaudible 00:01:40] fall of the year. So yeah, that's an introduction of myself and what we do.
Noah Newman:
Wow, it sounds like you're doing a lot with cover crops, and we'll get into all those details here over the next 20 minutes or so. I wanted to ask you how long have you been farming for, and is that run in the family? Are there a lot of generations, or what's the background there?
Chris Conley:
So, my great-grandparents started farming here in 1927. They immigrated here from Switzerland. Our farm is a very hilly farm. The reason they chose this farm was because it reminded them of their homeland with the hills and all that. So, we do farm a lot of hills. I have been farming since high school. I graduated high school in 1999 and I started farming with my grandparents. So now, I just took over to management of it. My grandma still owns the farm, yet my wife and I own the cattle and a machinery. And so, when I was farming with my grandpa, we were full tillage, chisel plowing, and discing, and to full works. We did have contour strips. My grandpa was pretty big into conservation at his time, with at least he had the contour strips. And then, five years ago I transitioned... Well, first I went to speak with Dodge County Healthy Soil and Healthy Water Group.
They're a big farmer-led group here in Dodge County. A friend of mine was wanting me to go to their annual meeting, and I didn't want to at first. I was very hesitant on cover cropping, and no-tilling because that just didn't seem like it was ever going to work. So I was wishy washy about going. Finally, I decided to go. It was in February, so I didn't have much else going on. And at that time, I seen our demonstration with the rain simulator and then I was like, "Wow, that is really impressive how ground cover will absorb water and infiltration rates on that compared to work ground, how it doesn't absorb water at all." You think it does, and during that demonstration you can for surely see it. And then, I started watching TV shows on water quality throughout the world and thought, "Wow, maybe I should think about doing something like that."
So I experimented with five acres of land I planted, and I had better emergence on my corn than in the conventionally work around. So then after that, the next year, I went from five acres of my farm no tilling to 100%. And then, that second year I introduced probably 20 acres of rye. And then after that, I planted no-till and at 20 acres of rye, and then I seen it working really well. So then the year after that, I went full planting green. So within a five year time I went from conventional tillage to planting green.
Noah Newman:
Wow.
Chris Conley:
And I've even gotten to the point now where I've sold chisel plow. I sold two tractors already, just for the fact that I don't need extra tractors for doing all that tillage work. I have a friend of mine that does my custom harvesting, so that eliminates the need for a big tractor, plant chopper. So, I've consolidated a bunch of things because of the practices that I now do.
Noah Newman:
Wow. From a five year window, you really ramped it up there. In that five years, did you have any pushback from your grandparents because they did it one way their entire lives and then boom, you came in and switched things up?
Chris Conley:
No. Not really, because when I started transitioning, that's when I started managing the farm because my grandpa had a stroke. So then, I started managing the farm. And it was an economic thing too because with us being a small dairy, I really didn't feel the need to have to spend that much extra money on machinery when the way this practice works. So, it was kind of an economic thing along with the environmental aspect of it too, just for the cost savings on machinery, not having to maintain machinery and stuff like that. And especially now with the price of fuel the way it is, I'm glad that I did make that transition because it saves a lot of money on fuel.
Noah Newman:
Absolutely. Sounds like the timing was just perfect. And you mentioned the hills that you farm on, so I'd have to imagine that presents some unique management challenges. How do cover crops help you overcome some of those challenges, would you say?
Chris Conley:
Well, cover crops work both ways in my favor I feel, because with the [inaudible 00:06:28] slope that there is to the land, it helps with watery erosion, and it also helps... It's a two-way street there because it helps with water erosion and it also helps add more organic matter to the hills, which in return helps keep the moisture retained during hot times and dry times. Because obviously with hills they're the first to dry out, so it's nice to be able to keep moisture there with the soil protected, and with the cover crops it adds a lot of infiltration rates to the ground.
Noah Newman:
And you mentioned how you plant green now. Were you nervous at first when you jumped in with that?
Chris Conley:
Oh, yeah. Very nervous because... So, along this whole time I was really hesitant to even start this because everybody that is no tilling around my area, they have pretty sophisticated planters. They're big planters, big tractors, a lot of electronics on there, telling you what your population is, what your fertilizer rates are, how fast you're going. And I've just got a John Deere 7000 Corn Planter, still [inaudible 00:07:40] wide from the early eighties. I'm like, "Wow, gosh, I am never going to be able to no-till with this thing because this is just too old and you can't do nothing like that." So then, the funny thing is I started doing a lot of research on the internet, watching YouTube videos and reading the articles and all that, and come to find out that the early adopters of no till, that's what they started planting their crops with.
So I'm like, "Well, if they started out with that, then I should be able to do it," and so I just started looking at planters and to be able to put the box to the ground is basically the same thing is just that the new planters, you can go faster doing it, and they have the capability of showing you what your down force pressure is and all that. So, I just went, I'm like, "Well, if it takes me a little bit longer to plant, that's fine because I'm not spending all this time chisel plowing and finishing the field and all that, so if I drive a little bit slower, I'm still money ahead," and so I was like, "Okay, this is what I'm going to do," and since I don't use my insecticide boxes, I put two 50 pound bags of sand in each insecticide box to help with down pressure.
And then, I put May West spike closing wheels on it, or poly closing wheels. I found them off of Craigslist. And then, I found some [inaudible 00:09:07] cleaners, I found them used too, and put some Keaton seed firmers on there. And them are the modifications that I've used on my planter and it works really well. So, I'd like to tell people that if you're thinking about doing it, no-tilling, even planting green, the old planters are more than capable of doing it, and you don't have to spend a lot of money on sophisticated equipment to do it.
Noah Newman:
People love to hear that, I'm sure. It's amazing how much you could teach yourself just going online, YouTube, Google, and all that. Let me ask you this, how do you terminate?
Chris Conley:
I terminate my rye by, I use a spray herbicide to kill the cover crop. I have my local co-op that sprays it. I haven't gotten that far yet to see if I really want to spray or not because I only grow about 50 acres of corn. So, I'm right on the fence as to, I know I could save some money on it, but then it's also one of them things too that, for that amount of acres, then I don't have to deal with the empty chemical jugs and getting rid of them. So I guess that would be up to people decide what they really want to do. So, that's just how I do it. In the future, I would like to get into experimenting with roller crimping. I just haven't got to that point yet. I've made a lot of changes here in five years and there's still a lot I want to do, and I'm very excited about it, but I just haven't got to that point yet.
Noah Newman:
Yeah, that's funny. I was literally just going to ask you about roller crimping because I've been interviewing a few people that have been doing it, so it seems like a lot of people are trying that out. So, you'll have to let us know if you do try it, how it goes.
Chris Conley:
Yep. Oh, and then I'd like to say too, you were asking if was worrisome planting into cover crop: yeah, when I first started planting into a cover crop, it was very worrisome because the rye is, I don't know, I planted into three, four foot tall rye. I planted into existing sod fields, which were about a foot and a half, two feet tall of grass. So it's pretty worrisome. Making a change from a clean field to be planting into a field that's totally overgrown, it's a weird feeling, but the first three years, I was pretty nervous about it. I'd be out there digging my corn to make sure it's sprouted, and see if it's coming up and all that. But now that's one thing that don't really bother me no more. If you get the cover crop and sod terminated in time, it'll pull through it.
Noah Newman:
So you use cereal rye. Are there any other species that you use?
Chris Conley:
Nope. I'm just with cereal rye right now. That's another thing I'm also on the fence with right now is because, by the time I get corn silage off and my high moisture grain, there's not really any extra time left in the year, good growing degree days to get something else really established really well. I'm thinking about adjusting my corn, maybe planting shorter day corn so I can get it off earlier to get my cover crops planted earlier. Then, I could introduce another species or so into the mix. So, that's something else I'm really looking into also.
Noah Newman:
And let's press pause for a second to thank our sponsor, Verdesian Life Sciences. They have a special message for you: at Verdesian Life Sciences, we believe that supplying healthy water and soil for the next generation is just as important as applying efficient nutrients for every crop farmers grow. For us, sustainability and profitability go hand in hand. That's why we call ourselves the nutrient use efficiency people. We have dedicated ourselves to providing prescriptive nutrient use efficiency solutions that improve plant uptake and reduce fertilizer losses, helping preserve the environment and make the most of your investment. Learn more at vlsci.com. Now, back to the podcast.
What equipment do you use to seed your cover crops?
Chris Conley:
Well that's kind of a story itself too.
Noah Newman:
Oh yeah, we got time. Let's hear it.
Chris Conley:
Okay. So, when I first started planting my cover crops, once again, I did not have anything for no-tilling. So I just used my conventional grain drill, went out there and planted the cover crop. I did that for the first year, I experimented with it, and then the second year. Then, I rented a no-till drill, and that made a huge difference. Then I was like, "Well, I really want a no-till drill, but I can't really afford one."
So, I wound up finding a no-till drill in Missouri, and it was an old United Farm tool no-till drill. Them drills are pretty obsolete now, but the thing is that with that drill is that everything's pretty much standard size bolts, nuts, bushings, bearings, except for the seed disc bearings and seed disc. But them, I can get from [inaudible 00:14:27]. The gauge wheels were, I found them in [inaudible 00:14:30] from... They're the same as some John Deere piece of equipment, so that was kind of universal. So I found out that there's some things that are universal on there, so if you're good at working on machinery, it's an all right drill. It's a good drill to start out with. So I mean eventually I would like to upgrade, but just at this time as funds don't really allow for that, so it's the best I could do at the time. So, it's working.
Noah Newman:
Hey, you're getting the most bang for your buck. What are your rates? How many pounds of cereal rye do you apply per acre would you say, off the top of your head?
Chris Conley:
Well, I started out with about 60, and last year I upped it to 90 to 100 pounds because I was going to try roller crimping this year, but it didn't work out. The rye tall enough to roller crimp by the time I went to plant corn because I planted it late, and we had a cool, wet spring. So, it just didn't work in my favor to roller crimp it, but it worked out where I grazed it because the cows had more feed there.
Noah Newman:
Perfect transition. I was just going ask you about grazing. I know you mentioned it off the top of the interview, but it sounds like that's a big part of your cover crop game plan with the grazing with it. Just give us the details on that and the benefits you've seen from grazing cover crops.
Chris Conley:
So like I said, we've had 23 acres of permanent pasture. That started out, my grandpa had all the pastures laid out. That was land that was too steep to farm, so he was grazing cows at that. I started now dividing them pastures up into halves and now in the spring of year I've even gone as far as them halves I make, I've even used temporary poly wire now to graze, only give them so much at a certain time because the pastures are becoming better with better management practices on that. Through the pasture part, I've noticed that with giving them only so much per day or per 12 hours during milking times, it better spreads the manure out throughout the pastures. Because before, with such a large area, the cows were usually going one area, leaving the manure there, and then going and eating the grass down to the ground on other areas.
But now with the manure and me moving them better, the grass is better all throughout the pasture, and what I've seen on that, the water infiltration rates are a lot better on that, because now the grass grows back a lot faster, and I don't graze it all the way down to the ground. So I leave about a five to six inch stubble behind, and the grass grows back a lot faster because of that. And with it, taller [inaudible 00:17:20] of soil, water infiltration rates are better. I've started now with my contour strips running poly wire on that. Same practices, the pastures of springtime, I move a poly wire every 12 hours. So, in the morning I move it, give them that amount of area. Then, when I bring the cows back, I move the wire again. So, at nighttime they have more of an area to eat.
And then if it gets too far, I also run a back wire to keep them from going back over stuff that they have eaten off. So, that's something that I'm really getting into now too. And then, as far as grazing cover crops, I just started that last year. I grazed the fields closest to the buildings on the cover crop rye, and that really works out well because that's probably given me close to an extra month's worth of feed that I can either store for over summertime, or that I don't have to make. So, that's worked out really well too.
And it works really well with the cows grazing it because they're out there making their feeds, spreading their own manure, and there's very little I have to do with them besides putting a wire up in springtime. And then, when the cows are done, I just go out there, plant corn. The rye will keep growing, so I do terminate that with herbicide then too. So, that's pretty awesome. I'm really happy with how this is all turning out and working in my favor.
Noah Newman:
Yeah, it's amazing how much you've accomplished in five years. Do you still go to the Dodge County meetings or have you interacted with any of those farmers, and told them about how the light bulb went on for you thanks to them and how much it's kind of changed your operation?
Chris Conley:
Oh yeah, I'm very involved with that group. Tony [inaudible 00:19:09], he is the chairman with it. He actually had the governor of our state come out to our farm, and see how the cover crop is working, and see the cows grazing and all that. Yes, I'm very active with that.
I told the group that I wouldn't be where I'm at without that farmer, that group, because with them, they're the ones that had shown me... Well, not shown me, but shown a whole group of people what the benefits of this can do for you. So, yeah, it's the Dodge County Farmer Group is a very good group. And I would suggest anybody that, if you're thinking about a practice like that, to get involved with a farmer led group. I found out that there's no stupid questions too, anything like this. If you got the question, just ask it.
People that are involved in these groups are more than willing to help you out. And they may even learn something off of an idea because you ask a question. People that are involved in these watershed groups and farmers like myself that are involved with practices like this, we're all trying to learn something too. We don't all know everything. So, it would be a good thing to ask a question because you never know what that might make a light bulb go on for somebody else too. So, it'd be a very good thing to get involved in a group like that. Or people that are doing practices like that, you don't even have to be afraid to go up to them and ask them questions because myself, I'm more than willing to answer questions if I can answer them for somebody else. If it'll help them out on their farming operation, help them with soil quality, water quality, even the economics of it, that's a good thing for anybody farming.
Noah Newman:
Well, we'll end with this, just thinking about your five year journey into no-till and cover crops: what would you say were some of the biggest challenges you faced when you first started with cover crops, and the biggest benefits that kept you pushing through those challenges?
Chris Conley:
Some of my biggest hurdles in the whole thing was, one was my equipment. I wasn't really sure if it was going to work. Two, I was a small farmer. I didn't know if there's going to be anybody out there that wanted to work with me on that. I guess weather conditions.
When I first started planting, going from tillage to non-tillage to soil wasn't really conditioned. So, there was a lot of smearing of the side walls. The soil was a lot water and tackier. But now that I've been doing it, the soil's been becoming more mellow. It's not as wet when I plant, just because the soil's getting more conditioned. It's getting healthier.
So, it takes some time to get your soil conditioned and working again after you've been tilling it. And when you go through the chisel plow, or moldboard plow, you're basically pushing the soil and sliding and off to the side of your shovels so it compacts it and makes it tight. So, that was one problem I guess I had on that. Benefits I've seen from it is just the whole aspect of, I don't have any erosion anymore, the water infiltration, seems like the crops are getting healthier now. So, them are all things that I've seen.
Noah Newman:
Well, great stuff, Chris. This has been an awesome conversation. 20 minutes have just flown by. Anything else you want to add before we let you go?
Chris Conley:
I'd also like to point out too that it's more of a peaceful thing when you're out there planting into a living crop. It's just, I really love the bright blue sky and planting into something green. You can see the birds that are flying around in an open field that's perfectly finished. You don't have the birds nesting in the grass and all that. And it's just, the wildlife aspect that comes back to it when you're out planting, and what you see going on is it's a really awesome thing. It's pretty cool.
Noah Newman:
And that'll wrap things up for this week's edition of Cover Crop Strategies. Thanks to Chris Conley once again for joining us. Thanks to our sponsor, Verdesian Life Sciences. You can check out everything they have to offer at vlsci.com. And of course, thank you very much for listening. Until next time, remember, for all things cover crops, head to covercropstrategies.com.
Post a comment
Report Abusive Comment